What exactly does everyone do in their free time?

[loller]

mengmary said:

loller said:

I will.

Notice how the old people spent more time complaining rather than addressing the question?
That's called irony.

I don't remember complaining.

I answered your question politely and succinctly.

Yeah, I made a mental note to use the qualifier "most," but I was tired and forgot. My apologies.

The word irony applies and if you can't see it, then maybe I should add the word oblivious to the list. I was being facetious, lighten the m'kay up.

[Lotus Eater]

I don't know how to define old. Xi'an has 7 million people. Not big by Chinese standards.

But I teach 12 hours a week, and then voluntarily coach debating teams and speech contestants, and help a bunch of people with their English during the week. I am also starting up a Public Speaking group - registration started today - already have 4 pages filled with names and it won't close until Friday!!

In my free time, I play on the computer, climb mountains, head out into the country as often as possible, ride my bike, visit friends in villages, hit the bars and nightclubs dancing until until early or late depending again on your definitions.

As often as possible I travel - latest plans are to hit Sapporo for May week. While in China I have been to Mt. Everest (Qomolongma), Xinjiang where I was smuggled over the border into Kazahkstan, done camel and horse treks in Inner Mongolia, spent 5 days horse trekking in Gansu, living in nomad tents and sleeping on the floor of village houses. Last October I headed for Malaysia. I've also trekked in the hills around Guizhou, played in other parts of southern China.

In between times I read, write, study Chinese, collect teas and attendant paraphenalia, collect local art particularly nongmin hua and traditional scrolls, drink with friends at home, watch DVDs, photograph stuff. Eating and shopping falls in some of the spaces left over. Finding time to sleep is my biggest problem.

These are all eminently boring activities to anyone who is prone to be bored. Boring is in your own head, same as old. Facetious is fine - but you need to use a smiley.

[acjade]

Jesus, Lotus. Your're a legend in your own home town.

[Lotus Eater]

Nope, I just enjoy my life. I figure I am extraordinarily lucky to be here, in good health and able to do the things I enjoy - so I am going to make the most of whatever is offered.

If I ever complained to my mother about being bored she would find some work for me to do - usually weeding her extensive gardens or ironing. I learned very quickly.

[gengrant]

LE, I think we had the same mom...

[loller]

deborann said:

I don't know how to define old. Xi'an has 7 million people. Not big by Chinese standards.

But I teach 12 hours a week, and then voluntarily coach debating teams and speech contestants, and help a bunch of people with their English during the week. I am also starting up a Public Speaking group - registration started today - already have 4 pages filled with names and it won't close until Friday!!

In my free time, I play on the computer, climb mountains, head out into the country as often as possible, ride my bike, visit friends in villages, hit the bars and nightclubs dancing until until early or late depending again on your definitions.

As often as possible I travel - latest plans are to hit Sapporo for May week. While in China I have been to Mt. Everest (Qomolongma), Xinjiang where I was smuggled over the border into Kazahkstan, done camel and horse treks in Inner Mongolia, spent 5 days horse trekking in Gansu, living in nomad tents and sleeping on the floor of village houses. Last October I headed for Malaysia. I've also trekked in the hills around Guizhou, played in other parts of southern China.

In between times I read, write, study Chinese, collect teas and attendant paraphenalia, collect local art particularly nongmin hua and traditional scrolls, drink with friends at home, watch DVDs, photograph stuff. Eating and shopping falls in some of the spaces left over. Finding time to sleep is my biggest problem.

These are all eminently boring activities to anyone who is prone to be bored. Boring is in your own head, same as old. Facetious is fine - but you need to use a smiley.

By what means do you travel into the country and is it usually with friends? Tell me more of your country visits; as much as I hate living in rural areas, I think it'd be much more interesting to visit them in China.

I refuse to use smilies. I am above such facile attempts to pander to the lowest common denominator. The old people need not get so defensive and try to "argue" their way out of a non-insult.

[George61]

The old people need not get so defensive and try to "argue" their way out of a non-insult.

I didn't notice much defense. It was all-out attack!
Your "irony" attempt was noted, but you need to use a higher grade ore.

[Stil]

loller said:

I refuse to use smilies. I am above such facile attempts to pander to the lowest common denominator. The old people need not get so defensive and try to "argue" their way out of a non-insult.

More insults Lolly? The smilies are used to clarify posts. Since your brand of sarcastic humour comes off as arrogant, you should use them to let everyone know you are joking, especially when you are new.

Old is complaining that old people are boring. The definition of boring is the same.

[Lotus Eater]

Depends on how far I am travelling. If it is long distances - usually by train. China has the best public transport system in the world. I LOVE hard sleeper.

If it is fairly close - by bus - local or long distance or in the event of no train, sleeper bus. If it is really local, bike or taxi.

I travel with friends or by myself, it doesn't make any difference to me. Both are fun, although the more foreigners you travel with the fewer local people will talk to you. Maximum number of foreigners that will manage to still have locals in villages talk etc is 3. 1 is always better for talking.

The rural and remote areas of China are fascinating. If I ever leave Xi'an that is where I will be headed.

Loller, in face to face conversation there are hundreds of clues as to a persons intent in speech - most of our understanding of what others say is NOT in their actual words. Even on the phone there are clues as to intent that are not contained in the actual words. On an internet forum we don't have these unconscious clues, therefore what can be intended as wit comes across as attack. This is why smilies were invented - to consciously take the place of body language, vocal tones etc. They are to increase understanding and ensure that you don't mistakenly upset people.

We are a peaceable group here - happy to share our experiences with all and sundry, more than happy to have a joke, a really intense discussion (have a look at the death penalty thread - I've forgotten it's name now) and offer beer or drinks of your choice.

But we are also a community that has some unwritten rules like any other community of people - so please join us, enjoy what we can offer, let us enjoy what you can offer - but be careful - and use the smilies if it's possible you may be misunderstood.

[gengrant]

Can I get an 'AMEN?'

[loller]

deborann said:

Depends on how far I am travelling. If it is long distances - usually by train. China has the best public transport system in the world. I LOVE hard sleeper.

If it is fairly close - by bus - local or long distance or in the event of no train, sleeper bus. If it is really local, bike or taxi.

I travel with friends or by myself, it doesn't make any difference to me. Both are fun, although the more foreigners you travel with the fewer local people will talk to you. Maximum number of foreigners that will manage to still have locals in villages talk etc is 3. 1 is always better for talking.

The rural and remote areas of China are fascinating. If I ever leave Xi'an that is where I will be headed.

Loller, in face to face conversation there are hundreds of clues as to a persons intent in speech - most of our understanding of what others say is NOT in their actual words. Even on the phone there are clues as to intent that are not contained in the actual words. On an internet forum we don't have these unconscious clues, therefore what can be intended as wit comes across as attack. This is why smilies were invented - to consciously take the place of body language, vocal tones etc. They are to increase understanding and ensure that you don't mistakenly upset people.

We are a peaceable group here - happy to share our experiences with all and sundry, more than happy to have a joke, a really intense discussion (have a look at the death penalty thread - I've forgotten it's name now) and offer beer or drinks of your choice.

But we are also a community that has some unwritten rules like any other community of people - so please join us, enjoy what we can offer, let us enjoy what you can offer - but be careful - and use the smilies if it's possible you may be misunderstood.

Do they treat you any different than the locals? Beyond the staring and questions I guess.


And now now, I've been using this here internet for many years, more than likely longer than any of the older people. I'm well aware of the drawbacks so there's no need to offer any advice on misunderstandings. I really hate smilies, especially when they're overused. How about people not assume everything's an insult to their age-old wisdom. My saying "boring" followed by an OBVIOUSLY joking question of affirmation akin to that of any regular forum-goer with bad spelling; hence the "am i rite?" wasn't even remotely offensive.

I could've said you were too busy pooting yourself to go out and do anything, but that would be highly stereotypical and naive, now wouldn't it?

"More insults Lolly? [image] The smilies are used to clarify posts. Since your brand of sarcastic humour comes off as arrogant, you should use them to let everyone know you are joking, especially when you are new.

Old is complaining that old people are boring. The definition of boring is the same."

Calling them defensive is an insult? ...sure. Let me clarify, Acjade was the main perpetrator of unecessary defensive tactics, not the rest of the older people who don't immediately take offense to a gentle jab at their social life's excitement levels.

More of a comment than a complaint. I mean, it's your life, why should I care if I find it boring?

[George61]

Old is complaining that old people are boring. The definition of boring is the same."

Calling them defensive is an insult? ...sure. Let me clarify, Acjade was the main perpetrator of unecessary defensive tactics, not the rest of the older people who don't immediately take offense to agentle jab at their social life's excitement levels.

More of a comment than a complaint. I mean, it's your life, why should I care if I find it boring?

Why call us boring in the first place?

I think it's all in your mind. A variety of interests is more than just a skateboard in an empty space. Don't assume just because we are older than you, that we are boring. We happen to know a lot more than you about many things.
Unfortunately, as you age, your body refuses to allow a lot of things to happen. This you will find out in due course. For example, I don't play basketball as well as I used to, and I certainly wouldn't even try to play football...but I could still kick a footie around 50 yards.
Personally, I find a skateboard very uninteresting. To me it is a lone, ego-driven activity. poo, even a dog can ride a skateboard!
Ask any of the people on this board about their particular skills......you might just be surprised.
Old means experienced. You haven't got much yet.
Take Lotus as an example. When you can state that you have accomplished as much as her, then you can do a bit of bragging.

[loller]

Because I wanted to know the ages in the first place, so I made a joke about the neccessity of including age because of the notable differences in what we each find enjoyable. I don't know why you feel the need to over-analyze such a simple situation. Drawing conclusions like, "A variety of interests is more than just a skateboard" is so freaking off-base and out of left field. When the hell did I even imply anything to do with any type of hierarchy of what's boring? You guys assume way too much. ...I'm 21. I don't skateboard. Haven't done it since I was 12. Old means experienced? Wow, you are blowing my mind here Captain Obvious. What the m'kay is up with old people and repeating the same poo over and over and over....

[Stil]

loller said:

Do they treat you any different than the locals? Beyond the staring and questions I guess.

Yes,you get treated differently from the locals but that doesn't mean it's bad. People are unbelievably friendly and curious. Some people find the curiosity off-putting ie staring, but strangers here will go well out of their way to help you. China is a place of extremes. A palatial mansion in a shanty town, mounds of garbage next to the most incredibly beautiful scenery and boorish behaviour coupled with genuine friendliness. In tourist areas you must be careful not to get ripped off though. You are seen as rich so a vendor will bargain accordingly

loller said:

And now now, I've been using this here internet for many years, more than likely longer than any of the older people. I'm well aware of the drawbacks so there's no need to offer any advice on misunderstandings. I really hate smilies, especially when they're overused.

Loller, you want people to respect your internet experience but don't return the favour by respecting life experience.

I understand you don't like smilies, I don't use them much myself, but when long standing forum members are asking you to use them so that they can understand your intent, don't you think it's prudent to acquiesce? Especially at the beginning when many may not understand your brand of humour. Would you rather be perceived as rude and insulting than to use a smilie face? If so, you are really saying a lot about yourself that would not be considered positive.

loller said:

How about people not assume everything's an insult to their age-old wisdom.

I wonder why you think everyone else should change for you. Bull in a china shop doesn't fly here. Btw, in China there is real respect for older people especially outside the largest cities and including the youth.

[George61]

I've been using this here internet for many years, more than likely longer than any of the older people.

...I'm 21

Yes, Loller...of course!
...and you're still holding the wrong end of the stick.

[loller]

stil said:

loller said:

Do they treat you any different than the locals? Beyond the staring and questions I guess.

Yes,you get treated differently from the locals but that doesn't mean it's bad. People are unbelievably friendly and curious. Some people find the curiosity off-putting ie staring, but strangers here will go well out of their way to help you. China is a place of extremes. A palatial mansion in a shanty town, mounds of garbage next to the most incredibly beautiful scenery and boorish behaviour coupled with genuine friendliness. In tourist areas you must be careful not to get ripped off though. You are seen as rich so a vendor will bargain accordingly



Loller, you want people to respect your internet experience but don't return the favour by respecting life experience.

I understand you don't like smilies, I don't use them much myself, but when long standing forum members are asking you to use them so that they can understand your intent, don't you think it's prudent to acquiesce? Especially at the beginning when many may not understand your brand of humour. Would you rather be perceived as rude and insulting than to use a smilie face? If so, you are really saying a lot about yourself that would not be considered positive.

loller said:

How about people not assume everything's an insult to their age-old wisdom.

I wonder why you think everyone else should change for you. Bull in a china shop doesn't fly here. Btw, in China there is real respect for older people especially outside the largest cities and including the youth.

Now see...internet experience perfectly relates to the situation because here people are telling me about how things can get misconstrued on the internet. This is not a new phenomenom for me. It correlates fine. ...now...respecting "life experience" is irrelevant. I didn't bring up life experience. I didn't mock anyone's life experience. I wouldn't have

If you don't want to change, don't change. I just don't want to get bitched at and start a huge freaking argument over an obviously facetious line. I'm not going to change to accomodate everyone's insecurities. And yes, I would rather be perceived as rude and insulting in most cases, unless it's a delicate situation; which this is not. It weeds out the sensitive people who feel the need to get defensive arbitrarily. Now now, you've all had plenty of time to bitch about how you're not getting the respect you deserve, you have life experience, and lots of other strawman arguments that don't apply. I have explained I was being facetious. How about you stop trying to "learn" me.




And George, I guess you were using the Internet in the 70s, huh? The World Wide Web, as we know it today, has its very own facets and distinctive traits and I have no doubts that many of you used it in its infancy, but hardly for the same things I did. For the purposes of "online chatting," I'm extremely well-versed in all of its foibles and downfalls. Please, for the love of all things good and pure, stop babying me.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Loller, you think we're old. It's true.
We think we have a lot of accumulated wisdom. We do.
Let's leave it at that.

[Raoul Duke]

Yes, let's. I'm locking this one down.

"Obvious", yes, but perhaps not in the way it may have been thought.

[Lotus Eater]

How you get treated in China is totally dependent on how you treat others here. If you give respect and interest that is exactly what you get back. I have found almost everyone to be friendly, amazingly generous and extremely accommodating. Not everyone has been as lucky as I have been in their relationships with Chinese people - and not always through their own fault either.

I am an absolute pain to travel with as I stop and talk to anyone who is around, I wander in and out of places and explore whatever I can. When people see I am genuine in wanting to understand them, their lives and what they are doing, they are fabulous to me.

I don't mind the staring - I stare at everything new and interesting as well. I don't mind the 'hello' or the 'laowai' - I have a stock answer that causes laughter and friendliness.

This also extends to the foreign population here. Loller, I was teaching my daughters how to use the ethernet, WWW and computers well before you were born. I was using computers back in the days of mainframes and little punched cards. BUT I will admit I am an end-user - I have done the bare minimum of programming I needed to do to pass my courses. I am more than happy to accept techie advice and help from people who are more experienced and better at this than I am.

ncluding age because of the notable differences in what we each find enjoyable.

Not certain you can make that generalisation. I like travel, dancing, music of all types except country and western and jazz, eating, anda a whole pile of other stuff. Most of my friends are between 24 and 35 - they like the same things. My students invite me out with them to go to eat, dancing karaoke and other stuff - they are between 20 and 24. Interests are not age dependent.

I just don't want to get bitched at and start a huge freaking argument over an obviously facetious line.

If several members of this forum did not see this as a facetious line, then do you think that it is possible that the miscommunication is not only at this end of the computer? You may see smilies as juvenile and accommodating to the LCD, but they were invented for and continue to exist for a very specific purpose - to ensure that what is said is NOT misconstrued.

Now can we all shake hands and start over?
Sorry Raoul - we must have posted at the same time.

[Raoul Duke]

This horribly misguided thread has been locked.