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Post by Dragonsaver on Sept 14, 2005 9:48:31 GMT 7
I was on a website linked from the eslteacher board. The website is : www.bearcanada.com/eslmain.htmlHe has a lot of information on contracts and scams and things to look out for in a contract. He also lists some recruiters that are scam artists. I will paste a couple of items he has as examples in a scam contract and then his answer to this. What I want to know is if he is correct. Are these items which should not be included in a 'good' contract. I have a new contract which in fact includes these items.  How to Spot a Scam - Contract XIV. Breach Penalty When either of the two parties fails to fulfill the contract or fails to fulfill the contract obligations according to the terms stipulated, that is, breaks the contract, it must pay a breach penalty of US $ 1,000 (or the equivalent in RMB). His reply: There is no justification for such a clause in a teaching contract and you should NEVER sign such a thing, even if it isn't strictly enforceable. The school will use it to avoid paying you your current and last month's salary and your travel expenses. And you can be sure that any school with a clause like this one will not pay you if they breach their agreement. 2. The Teacher shall observe The School's working system and regulations concerning administration of foreign experts and shall accept The School's arrangement, direction, supervision and evaluation in regard to his/her work. Without The School's consent, The Teacher shall not render service elsewhere or hold concurrently any post unrelated to the work agreed on with The School. Lots of bad stuff here; a great escape clause for the recruiter or the school. In any contract you must always avoid undefined terms like "observe the working system" and "accept the School's arrangement". Even worse is "accept the School's evaluation". You're completely unprotected. With this clause in your contract, I could fire you on a whim and you would have no recourse in any country. In particular, such a clause must state that your evaluation cannot affect your pay. If the evaluation is poor the school should have a way of terminating the contract after 6 months, but nothing else should be precipitated by an undefined "evaluation". See comments above about having to follow the "direction". Lastly, the provision about requiring the permission of the school "to render service elsewhere" or to hold any post "unrelated" to the school is a strike issue. VERBOTEN. Your free time is your own to do with as you please, including teaching English elsewhere or giving private lessons. If they won't delete this, WALK AWAY immediately. And be sure to delete any reference to requiring "permission" to do anything on your own time. This is just the recruiter or the shoddy private "schools" taking advantage you; don't give in to it. |
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Post by Stil on Sept 14, 2005 12:09:56 GMT 7
XIV. Breach Penalty When either of the two parties fails to fulfill the contract or fails to fulfill the contract obligations according to the terms stipulated, that is, breaks the contract, it must pay a breach penalty of US $ 1,000 (or the equivalent in RMB). In Hunan the Provincial contract states 2000US penalty to the school and the teacher if one of them breaks the contract. Very difficult to claim for either party. All schools and foreign teachers must sign this here. 2. The Teacher shall observe The School's working system and regulations concerning administration of foreign experts and shall accept The School's arrangement, direction, supervision and evaluation in regard to his/her work. Without The School's consent, The Teacher shall not render service elsewhere or hold concurrently any post unrelated to the work agreed on with The School. Looks normal to me. The school wants you to teach the classes in the manner they want and don't want you to work outside the school. They paid for your visa why should they let another company benifit. Private teaching is over-looked generally and the schools may even offer you some privates if it's good for their guanxi In particular, such a clause must state that your evaluation cannot affect your pay. I have never heard of an evaluation affecting the pay unless it states it in the contract. i.e evaluated bonus. That doesn't mean it couldn't happen though. Lastly, the provision about requiring the permission of the school "to render service elsewhere" or to hold any post "unrelated" to the school is a strike issue. VERBOTEN. Your free time is your own to do with as you please, including teaching English elsewhere or giving private lessons. If they won't delete this, WALK AWAY immediately. And be sure to delete any reference to requiring "permission" to do anything on your own time. This is just the recruiter or the shoddy private "schools" taking advantage you; don't give in to it. I really don't agree with this. If you worked at Nike you think on your free time it would be ok to work at Addidas? They want to keep you from working for the competition. Schools have recruitment issues to deal with. As I said generally privates are ignored. It seems as if Bearcanada is taking a western approach with regards to looking at a contract. They can all be just crap-shoots here. In the west a contract is the end of negotiation but here a contract can be the beginning. I have had all of these provisions in my contracts and I have been fortunate to work at great schools. Good luck Dragon |
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Decurso
Barfly
Things you own end up owning you
Posts: 581
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Post by Decurso on Sept 14, 2005 21:33:47 GMT 7
You will likely be asked to sign two contracts.One is the standard China contract...the other is with the school specifically.Both the breach of contract penalty and no moonlighting clause are always in the standard contract.Neither are strictly enforceable.
Worry about stuff like whether or not your visa and permits are paid for.Make sure your contract is dated to the last day you intend on working.This guy is nitpicking.
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Post by Mr Nobody on Sept 14, 2005 22:14:27 GMT 7
They can't change the standard contract, that is written by the govt. The other one however can be open slather.
I got the breach penalty reduced a lot. I also got the non-working thingy to only be 'me no teach engrish' of the kind of thing taught were I work. I can teach any bloody thing else without even mentioning it, set up businesses work for others, etc, just not teach what I get paid for by them without telling them first. It is a valid non-competition clause.
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Post by con's fly is open on Sept 14, 2005 23:29:20 GMT 7
I had a non-competition thingummy last year: Dashiqiao is small enough that the school has a monopoly on foreigners. If you're going to work in a big city, though, don't stand for it... unless you have no intention of or inclination to moonlighting anyway.
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Post by Dragonsaver on Sept 15, 2005 3:55:56 GMT 7
I think I just agreed to come over next week. Pay is good it is a joint venture with a College in Ontario. I spoke with the Ontario College today. They want me to fly over next Thursday. It is in Wuxi which is near Shanghai. They are booking my flight today. I am coming over on a visitors visa and they will get the Z. Lady at Lambton College in Ontario said there will be no delay on the visa. Oh, sh** I guess I will have to buy a suitcase and start packing. Oh, S.......... |
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Post by George61 on Sept 15, 2005 4:09:25 GMT 7
And this is where the fun begins! I hopw you've read the threads on "what do I pack", " how much can I carry", etc.
Wuxi isn't all that far from the dreaded Suzhou.
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Post by Dragonsaver on Sept 15, 2005 4:50:51 GMT 7
Wuxi isn't all that far from the dreaded Suzhou. Yes, that was the part I liked the best. That way maybe I can meet some of the illustrious denizens of the cafe. I just received my visa application in the e-mail I have to courier it to the travel agent tomorrow. The job is at Southern Yangtze University---Lambton College (SYUL). It isn't the job I started this thread about. I only have 50,000,000,000,000,000 things left to do. |
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Post by George61 on Sept 15, 2005 5:56:37 GMT 7
"snicker"
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Ruth
SuperDuperMegaBarfly 
God's provisions are strategically placed along the path of your obedience.
Posts: 3,915
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Post by Ruth on Sept 15, 2005 10:48:17 GMT 7
You'll need the energy of George's chicken to get you through the next week. Here - take some of these bouncy things as well:  Congrats and get packing. Hope it turns out to be a GREAT experience for you. |
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Post by con's fly is open on Sept 15, 2005 23:49:37 GMT 7
DS, bring pooploads of books and music, and deodorant et. al., but skimp on everything else. Hell, it's supposed to be an adventure here. And the shopping is wicked.
Oh, Canadian tourist cheese trinkets! They go over big here.
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Post by Dragonsaver on Sept 16, 2005 4:21:24 GMT 7
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Post by Mr Nobody on Sept 16, 2005 6:53:42 GMT 7
I think he just means cheesy tourist trash. Made in China, of course.
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Ruth
SuperDuperMegaBarfly
God's provisions are strategically placed along the path of your obedience.
Posts: 3,915
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Post by Ruth on Sept 16, 2005 7:00:56 GMT 7
Yes. Hit the dollar stores and pick up key rings, rulers, pens, etc. with the Canadian flag or some animal native to Canada on them. Or bring rolls of loonies and toonies with you. We're giving those away, too. NOT the rolls. 1 toony or loony per person. To borrow from Mr. N. - meiyou qian.
Something else we brought back this year, and I wish we'd purchased more, is English-English paperback dictionaries. We brought enough to give as prizes to the top English students in each of our classes, but teachers are drooling and we don't have enough. This might not be an issue where you are going, given the proximity to Shanghai and foreign language bookstores.
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Crippler
Barfly
Beware the conspiracy!
Posts: 345
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Post by Crippler on Sept 16, 2005 21:13:01 GMT 7
I am pretty leary of anything bearcanada has to say. He appears to have an axe to grind. He is a pretty negative poster in the greasy spoon and really tends to stereotype issues.
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Post by Dragonsaver on Sept 17, 2005 8:55:20 GMT 7
I called my local MP's both Provincial and Federal. I've scored big. I'm getting approx 50 Cdn flag lapel pins, maybe some small flags, approx 40 Ontario Provincial pins, book markers and some other stuff. YEAH!!!  |
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Post by George61 on Sept 17, 2005 9:36:17 GMT 7
So politicians are useful, after all! Good idea, DS.
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Post by Mr Nobody on Sept 17, 2005 9:41:01 GMT 7
Bloody hell, that's good thinking. I wonder if the consulate here .......
Or maybe back home . . . . .
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Ruth
SuperDuperMegaBarfly
God's provisions are strategically placed along the path of your obedience.
Posts: 3,915
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Post by Ruth on Sept 17, 2005 18:14:20 GMT 7
Dragonsaver - that was BRILLIANT! Wish I'd thought of it.
I have a few stamp collector friends and relatives who donated to the cause and some students and teachers here have been thrilled to receive some stamps. Not for everybody, and not sure how uni students would respond, but quite a nice little 'something' for folks who appreciate that kind of thing.
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Post by Lotus Eater on Sept 19, 2005 0:21:56 GMT 7
The federal pollies in Oz will give you stuff for taking overseas - proper size Oz flags and other dongxi. My daughter collected a heap of stuff from the local federal member before she went to Argentina as an exchange student.
People in China will give you of what ever they have. Their kindness and generosity is overwhelming. I was at least able to give tie pins and small brooches of koalas and kangaroos to people when they gave me gifts and for official occasions. I was able to take key rings books calendars etc out to peoples's places when they invited me for dinner. They will not open the gift while you are there, but if you return, they will either be wearing it, or it will be in pride of place in their house.
Something, no matter how small from overseas appears to carry a cache that a bottle of baijiu or a carton of cigarettes or a box of tea (what I give now that I have run out of Oz gifts) doesn't have for the neighbours.
It is not a 'lady bountiful' or 'cargo cult' mentality, but a small way of repaying the immense generosity and kindness you will be shown if you are in any way friendly and open.
When I returned home for Spring Festival some of my uni students asked me to bring back postcards and stamps for them - collected them from family and friends at home and the students were happy. The interested ones will tell you if they want these types of things.
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Decurso
Barfly
Things you own end up owning you
Posts: 581
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Post by Decurso on Sept 19, 2005 2:06:02 GMT 7
Dragonsaver - that was BRILLIANT! No, no it isn't. Students don't need foreign teachers arriving like a Lord and Lady Bountiful throwing trinkets to the madding crowd from their open top carriages. Not true Slim...people eat that stuff up up here.I've brightened so many faces with a Canadian quarter that I can't even count. Also,if you ever have to explain what a beaver is a Canadian nickel comes in handy.There's nothing like that here...and no Chinese word for it as far as I know.I thought of giving a cheeky explaination...but I'd like to keep my job. ;D |
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Post by George61 on Sept 19, 2005 4:30:16 GMT 7
I took Chinese trinkets, and showered my lesser friends and acquaintances with them, when I went home last February. They all seemed to enjoy them. Slim, is England soo depressing?
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Ruth
SuperDuperMegaBarfly
God's provisions are strategically placed along the path of your obedience.
Posts: 3,915
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Post by Ruth on Sept 19, 2005 14:58:29 GMT 7
Slim, I think I can see where you are coming from. And if the gifts were given in that spirit, it would be wrong. However, if given the way Lotus described, gifts from a foreign country truly are appreciated. At least they have been in my experience. Possibly the attitude of the giver makes a huge difference.
Decurso, the money thing is a good idea, too. It's unique. My son (in the navy) brought us coins from Australia and Tonga when he stopped there. When I was a kid (in Canada) my dad had coins from England. No one else on the block had any. Students here appreciate it. But I don't go tossing them out to the masses as I travel down the street in my open top carriage.
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Crippler
Barfly
Beware the conspiracy!
Posts: 345
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Post by Crippler on Sept 19, 2005 15:05:06 GMT 7
Oh, I'm sorry. I wasn't aware that different opinions weren't allowed here. Aw Slim one, lighten up!  Of course we allow diverse opinions here. In fact we encourage them. It is fun shooting them down!  Don't worry, be happy! And of course, Everyone has the right to be wrong! Even you sometimes!!! Peace brother!  |
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Post by Dragonsaver on Sept 20, 2005 3:24:57 GMT 7
Something else we brought back this year, and I wish we'd purchased more, is English-English paperback dictionaries. We brought enough to give as prizes to the top English students in each of our classes, but teachers are drooling and we don't have enough. This might not be an issue where you are going, given the proximity to Shanghai and foreign language bookstores. Raoul, or others in the Suzhou, Wuxi area. Are English-English dictionaries easy to come by?? Walmart has them for $2 each, so I could bring over a bunch if students can't get them easily at the local book store. |
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