Take the good with the bad!

[Jollyjunklass]

Hi everyone, including George and child,

Can you tell me your, top 3 to 4, favorite things about China and, 3 to 4, least favorite things
Thanks

[Mr Nobody]

My opinion so far, for what it is worth.

Pros, in no particular order. food, the culture, the people, the history.
Cons, again in no order. Hygeine (they think it is a greeting), bad manners, crowds, the appalling lack of empathy.

Pros outway cons 10:1 except on bad days, like when you are sick, or I assume depressed or burned out a little. But i haven't lived there for more than 6 weeks at a time yet over the past 7 years, so i am a bit ignorant at this point.

I expect a lack of privacy will kick in somewhere later, which is a point i got from this board. Sometimes there is a feeling of helplessness when you can't explain, and sometimes in foreign countries (here my experience is a a much longer time in europe) you get sick of working so hard to try and get basic things like food due to the language issues. You just want to hide or talk to someone in your own language for a while. It passes. Friends help.

[Lotus Eater]

Favourites:

• Friends - people in general
• Opportunities to do and see things I wouldn't have back home
• Crazy juxtapositions of life in China
• ease of life

Least favourite:

• Distance from my daughters (although sometimes that is also on my favourite list!)
• my inability to communicate as effectively as I want to - sheer bloody laziness in studying on my part
• the need to fly/drive to get to places (because of distance/time constraints) when I want to stop and explore little streets or watch people go about their daily business.

[Newbs]

G'day Milana

In the order in which I think of them:
The old people
My pupils, most of whom are not like the horror stories that one hears about Chinese students
The price of beer
The good humour, craziness and plain old good fashion common sense advice that one gets down at the saloon. (Awww, group hug)

And now for the good, or is that the bad, now hang on a minute I'm confused here.
The daily battle to get anyone to ever use their initiative
The always positive, sino-centric message that is all pervasive
The hygeine
The pollution

[woza17]

That is a really good question. I am trying to think of the things I hate and I having a hard time coming up with something. Probalbly my frustration with teaching some students. I would just love to slip a fish in their ear and move on quietly.

I have been getting in to the gardening and went and bought a rake, a couple of students came along and as I was trying to explain what a rake was (you know the pig in Journey to the West carried one) anyone finally bought on for 15 kwai and starting putting all the rocks and rubbish into a pile thinking I will hire someone to take it all away the next day it was all gone.
I love getting the tradesmen hanging out on the corner ,to come and do some odd jobs around the apartment. I love Karoke rooms. The medicinal wine. The loving looks that are given to my dog as I walk along the street. Cheap DVDs of course. I hate the spitting of course. This has been mentioned on another thread but waiting for my beer. The waitress either puts the bottle out of my reach or on the table unopened and no glass.

[hankuh]

My time for reflection is based on living in the same place in China for almost five years with some commonalities and some differences with posters.

The positives, which tend to be personal:

1. My wife and her family: I feel very fortunate to have her in my life and to have her family here and frankly, she is the reason I have stayed here.

2. Teaching: I teach literature, not conversation classes for which I am grateful. I am pretty much left to teach my courses in the manner I wish to, without some PC litigation-minded administrator breathing down my neck telling me that I must have so many amount of essays assigned every semester and graded in a certain manner.

3. My students: it's both rewarding and tragic, but overall, I feel I have sharpened my teaching skills and we have shared a lot of humorous incidents in the classroom.

4. Living here for better or for worse, has made me appreciate my own native country, but at least here, I don't pay for power or for my rent and some of the women are utter knock outs.


The negatives, which tend to be cultural perhaps, or maybe that's debatable, maybe the negatives are reflective of my own shortcomings:

1. Circus Freak status--the unrelenting stares, snickers, laughter, the hellos, and laowai. The daily grind of this behavior can mean a "good China day" or a "bad China day." It gets old quickly.

2. Having Chinese standing not three feet away, looking at me, and talking about me as if I am not a sentient being, or even caring if I am, and doing the same when my wife is with me. I understand them, which sometimes makes me wish for that 45 day pink cloud phase when I first arrived in China.

3. Being far less trustful of people here.

4. The personal corruption of people's lives here.

[Ruth]

Good:
1. my work schedule is great. I feel like I am semi-retired. Not sure I'll ever be able to go back to a 40-hour workweek.
2. the food. I eat out, or take-away, or 'off the street' a lot more than I actually cook. It's cheap and delicious. Can't live like this at home because I can't afford to.
3. the people. Those I have come to know well are delightful. They struggle with the same issues I do, genuinely care about me and are among the most generous people I have had the pleasure of including in my life.
4. my students. Most of my private ones really want to learn English and try very hard. Ditto for a few of my students at school, but the classes are so large that I don't get the chance to get to know them.

Bad:
1. the large classes at school. Difficult to make a difference in two 45-minute classes a week with 70 kids per class.
2. the kids who disrupt my classes. I don't care if they sleep or do other schoolwork. I just want them to be quiet so the ones who do want to learn from me can hear me and I can hear them.
3. the education system. My high-school aged kids attend school 6.5 days a week. They start at 7:00 a.m. and finish at 9:00 p.m. They spend three years cramming for national tests that take 2 days and determine which university they will attend - and by extension, how the rest of their lives will be spent. They don't learn to think critically or outside the box. They have difficulty expressing an opinion that doesn't come from the text. They don't have LIVES!!! and that's sad.
4. the language barrier. My own fault. I'm lazy and don't use the tools around me well enough to improve.
5. okay, I know my 3 or 4 quota is up, but I'm going to keep going. I'm homesick a lot. This is personal, not China, and probably a huge dose of empty-nest syndrome, just magnified because I am half way around the world and my kids don't email as often as I want them to.
6. the spitting and littering. It could be so much better without these two.

[woza17]

Millana you will be us soon. I can tell you are excited but a tad worried and ask a lot of questions.
When I knew I was coming to China what I wanted at the time was the unexpected. At that time I felt a bit drained, lifeless really. I packed half a suitcase didn't have a clue where I was going, what I was meant to do and landed. I slept like a baby (i had been having trouble sleeping ) once I arrived, now the same issues that dogged me are returning but I have the time now to look at them. It is so easy here. I have had thoughts of going to the west of China to stretch myself.
That could happen. You seem like a good person, a decent, responsible person, enjoy.
I think you will do a good job here.
Cheers

[Jollyjunklass]

Thanks Woza,

And yeah, lifeless is a good word, just ready for a change. I am very excited, albeit nervous. I have been letting too many people, make too many decisions for me, for too long. There is not much left here that I'm really interested in taking on here, it all seems kinda boring to me. I need a challenge to begin the next stage of my life, need that flicker to wet my appetite again.

I have been craving a new experience for a long time now, just didn't have the balls, or maybe wasn't where I needed to be yet.

But, I think it's time to take the risk, with it's ups and downs. I ask a lot so I can get a feel as to whether, or not, I'm going to be capable, I know it may drive you guys nuts at times.

It's funny, in the old days, lol, I wouldn't have had one question, I would have jumped right in. With age comes caution, and I haven't figured out if that's a good thing yet.

Thanks for the vote of confidence. And yes, documents are on their way to my house, so it is all becoming real, ha! No turning back for this gurl. I am sure you have great advice to offer.

[con's fly is open]

The terror right before you leave is much like the moment before you jump out of a plane with (hopefully) a parachute. Yeah, statistically there's a chance something will go wrong.

Most people, being pussies, won't dare. But at best guess, there are 150.000 folks in China alone who HAVE dared. You're in good company. And you're gonna have a blast.
When ya comin', September?

[Jollyjunklass]

Yep,

I'm trying to get it all organized for September, fingers crossed.

[Mr Nobody]

Things are about a week away for me.

I will book a ticket soon as I get some paperwork, which should be over the next couple of days.

Then China!

[con's fly is open]

Nobby, good luck w/ the red tape, and a special prayer re: booking the flight. But then I booked mine with Airmiles...

Sorry, to the thread:
GOOD:
1. The students. Kids keep the heart young. I really missed the little bastards.
2. The hospitality. Reserved folks, these Sinos, but hearts the size of my bar tab. I could theoretically dine at a different household every night.
3. The networking. Strangers can go m'kay themselves, but if someone knows you, knows someone who knows you, or knows someone who knows someone who knows you, yer in. Yer in bigtime.
4. The food. i'll need an exercise regimen this time, 'cause it's hard to stop eating once you've had the first taste.

BAD:
1. The hucksters. I've been rooked badly on deals, especially while travelling.
2. The street manners. People barge through you while you're walking, cut each other off while driving, and worst of all, cut into line right in front of you. Chinese are among the politest people in the world... indoors.
3. The corruption. A few more ideals and a little less greed, and just maybe China's infrastructure would grow as fast as its economy.
4. Face. The concept has its good side in promoting manners and respect, but until people call a spade a spade in public, sleazebags can continue to walk the streets with impunity. And government would reform much faster. And pigs would fly.

[Newbs]

Mr N make sure you post here when you land in the Middle Kingdom.

[Newbs]

On second thoughts, don't bother. It'll be front page news in "China Daily" which I read religiously every day.

[Mr Nobody]

What, like with a cross in your hand, going "0h my God!" And the occassional "Back foul beast"?

"Nobody is coming to China"(Or did I already do that one?) "Nobody plans to move to China"

[woza17]

Mr. Nobody
Where are you actually going? You have probably told us but I cant't be arsed looking for the post.
Cheers Woza

[Mr Nobody]

The wonderful and green city of Nanning in the sunny south. I have little choice, the gf doesn't want to leave her job, since she loves it so much. It is much like an ideal laowai job, but not quite paid as well. She says the only way she is leaving it is to come to Oz.

The job I can get for asking isn't so good. Most of the jobs in that direction are poorly paid and have fewer benefits than up north. Not sure why. But, anyway, I am going very soon, and will even wear a less than salubrious pay and not so good conditions (No airfare, no flat, but I own one already there, no other benefits. They pay for the paperwork, and organize it for me) for the other conditions. (small interested classes full of college girls english majors, no other work than talking etc (no marking, no other duties, nothing), and great relationships with staff - the boss it my gf's college friend.)

so, I am applying at the uni, but they haven't responded yet. But other than that, think i will just take a 6 month contract with the other college and see how it goes.

[Jollyjunklass]

I think your lucky Bond,

I would love to be in that province, pay wouldn't really matter. They have an awesome agricultural uni there, but it's not in Nanning, it sounds and looks awesome anyway.

[Lotus Eater]

They have a pretty interesting Agricultural University outside Xi'an as well - Yangling. Has huge greenhouses of hydroponic plants, plus nearby a sheep cloning factory!

The veges tasted great.

[Mr Nobody]

I think I am being pretty silly taking the job, but i will only take a 6 month contract, then renegotiate or apply elsewhere. I don't care much right now, just want to get out of here.

I will be a great teacher - I have been at whatever else I have done. So, I will put my money where my mouth is and prove it. If I can handle the rest that goes with it, of course.

"Nobody doesn't have to take this any more."

[Beausie]

Good:

1. The other Foreigners here. There are only three of us at any time, so it's really important that we get on. I've been lucky to have great company and sympathetic ears when needed.

2. The students. Most of them are great, and going into class gives me a lift even on bad days.

3. The easy workload. I know it may sound crass, but I like my time off, including the long holidays when I get out of this small town and see something of the country.

Bad:

1. The generally bad attitude of the FAO to us foreign women. Luckily, his indifference to my welfare means that I don't have much to do with him.

2. The spitting and empty of noses onto the floor - especially in restaurants when I'm eating!!

3. As mentioned elsewhere, the idiots who stand a couple of feet from me and talk about me as though I'm an exhibit in a zoo. I christened myself The Giraffe! Some days I can just ignore it, some days it still gets to me.

Overall though, I'd say I enjoy it most of the time.

[woza17]

Hey Mr. Nobody maybe I could visit you. I have a cunning plan, I could travel around China my itinerary based on where my forum mates are. We could all throw our homes open for anyone from the forum who wants to visit that particular city or not.

Now back to the thread the spitting but I am so used to it now,it doesn't count. My laziness at not learning the language I am missing out on so much. I have to think of something bad, bugger I can't think of anything at the moment,
good
Some of the Dalian people have the craziest hairstyles I have ever seen in China. My dog's vet has absolutely ruined her hair to become a curly headed blonde like me.
I really want to take her to the hair hospital.
Cheers Woza

[Mr Nobody]

Woza, no worries, we have a spare bedroom. Welcome.

I put it like this when people ask me about China (remembering I haven't lived there only holidayed)
China is a country of contrasts. So, if you are the kind of person who can ignore the bad, then China is great. If you can't, and the good isn't enough to equal it, then you hate it.

Every country I have been to is, really, just China is more drastic, so people react more to it, to the extremes quite often.

[woza17]

Great I have been invited to Xian and now Nanning. Ruth remember you invited me for some earl grey tea are you still up for it ?