Biggest differences?

[Escaped Lunatic]

To throw things or not to throw things is very situation dependent. When I was a corporate trainer, most of us were more than happy to toss things around the room (some of the trainers even came in with a large supply of nerf balls), much to the horror of the "professional is what I like, unprofessional is anything I don't like" training manager. The students liked it and it kept class lively. With middle schoolers, I had to have an iron-clad rule that NOTHING be thrown without a direct order from me, and I seldom even tossed any items since they would start throwing things and say "but it must be ok if you did it."

If there is an open window, and if a student is a repeat offender, then I can see that tossing their precious items out the window could have considerable shock value. Naturally, this shouldn't be overused, or else some students will start bringing in stuff just for the amusement of seeing the teacher toss it.



"Those who are easily shocked should be shocked more often."
- Mae West

[Lotus Eater]

hankuh said:

Sorry Koko and others who throw stuff- I find this a bit less than professional.

And I find such a response by you not very convincing, maybe even unprofessional in itself, because you seem not willing to acknowledge that perhaps the various posters' experiences of teaching in a classroom in China differs from yours.

Teaching in China in a classroom has a host of difficulties and joys, and these all differ from public middle schools, 3rd, 4th, even 5th tier public colleges and universities and the private language mills.

As a FOREIGN teacher, the difficulties can manifest themselves from outside the classroom as well as inside the classroom, and all of this depends on where one is in China and for whom one works.

Hey Bubba, I did point out that I was at a university (and it's one of the 211 ones, so the students here are generally better than average). I know you have had some horrendous experiences and I DON'T discount them.

Back in Oz my first job was secondary school teacher and I had some all male classes at the lower end of the tech level. I was 19 when I started teaching them - same age as their sisters! These classes were not easy, and I struggled to maintain discipline. But I wasn't as big as most of the boys in the class, I am pretty crap at throwing accurately, and the female voice tends to get a bit shrill (great caricature material) if you are shouting at students over a din, so I had to develop other ways of managing.

So if you really want to it can be done. The throwing stuff and physical stuff still seems to me to be bad role modelling - and teachers are meant to be role models in more than just how to "talk proper".

[solongtinik]

i guess throwing things and physical abuse is a traditional kind of disciplining a student! i totally disagree! i hate seeing someone being embarassed not for any reason!

[gengrant]

can't say that I haven't debated the issue...it's kinda easy when you've got a small projectile in your hand, and the offending person is such an "easy" target...

but I do believe that a cooler head needs to be had in dealing with malcontents...sometimes the best offense is a good defense...and sometimes the best defense is no defense at all...

or, as a wise man (or was that wise arse) once said, "ignorance is bliss...but ignoring ignorance will help you keep your sanity."

but hey, a well-placed kick to the head couldn't always hurt, right?

[Raoul Duke]

I've thrown a few chalk shards myself. I'm glad I did it and if I was ever in those situations again I'd do the same thing. Being a "professional" in a Chinese school can sometimes be a bit like being a "gourmet" in a McDonald's.

I wouldn't want to deliberately just set out to embarass someone, but then I see things like sleeping or reading a newspaper in class to be about the ultimate in expressing disrespect...for you and for the class you're trying to teach.

If someone has to be embarrassed, I'd really just as soon it was them.

[hankuh]

Well, I've never thrown anything at any student (but I've been tempted); I have confiscated one or two magazines (those dirty Japanese ones ), and have told 2 or 3 students to put their own cellphones on off. I threw one copy of China Daily out the window--during the Hainan US recon plane crisis several years back.

I think the only violent thing I ever did in the classroom in China was when a wasp enter the classroom, and a few students were freaking out, and I killed it because, well, I don't like wasps.

There was one time when the restrooms were reeking particularly bad one afternoon (more than the normal reek, which means it was wretchedly awful) and I got upset about it. I think in the middle of Hamlet, I remarked, "Damn, I sick and tired of smelling everyone's poo!"

Oh yeah, maybe this counts, a classroom of adult students during one of my final exams were cheating, the textbooks out, the proctors letting them do it, and I walked in, and freaked, and started yanking the textbooks out of their hands, and throwing them into the corner. I had to do that three times. The proctors were resembling badly worm-rotted furniture at that point.

But that's really about it.

Best to keep a cool head; it ain't worth it if you don't; the ones to whom you are directing the anger, probably don't give a flip anyway, and might even look at it as entertainment or worse, get indignant and/or slander you with gossipy trash with the dean or the party secretary; so, yeah, Lotus Eater probably has a point. Better to let the students know where you are coming from in the beginning, rather than let them know during the act.

[Mr Nobody]

I don't chuck the chalk AT them, I aim to miss, hit the desk. Just to get their attention when all else fails. I have done it maybe 3 times, preferring other methods, but have yelled a few times.

Solong, how do you control your students? What kind of students do you teach?

The embarrassment I am talking about is a loss of face kind, and it works. I use humour a lot, too.

[Lotus Eater]

Back home hitting a kid is tantamount to getting fired - fast. Hitting one (innocent or otherwise) in the eye with something would not be a good career move, and likely cause you endless poverty in paying on-going damages.

Here - no matter how bad the student, I wouldn't want to live with having blinded someone with a well or poorly aimed shot. "It was an accident" "He was talking/reading a newspaper" doesn't really help justify the action when the student no longer has the sight of one eye.

[Mr Nobody]

Good point. Then, don't do it if you are likely to miss, or don't throw it so hard that it could cause injury. I don't.

[Lotus Eater]

Ricochets, kids move fast, you get the kid behind. Perfect shots we ain't. Even a small insect gently flitting into your eye can cause major damage. Don't do it is a better option.

[woza17]

Bubba and Lotus I think you are both right.
I only have brief periods with students except for my time in Dalian and if I had to do that over again I would take a leaf out of both of your books that means different books with different pages. Excuse me I am drinking Korean wine and it really affects my English.

Anyway with that said. today I am running around trying to get the evenings activities set up and there are kids underfoot. One little girl Shelly about 9 is my fav so I enlisted her to help me she was great then I got some of the other little buggers to help me and it was wonderful. The older children are always asking if they can help me and I direct them and they do a great job. Little Shelley got a grasp of the big picture.
The adults and TAs didn't understand so I told her to explain in Chinese.
Bubba these are our moments. I don't think you had many of those in China and that is China's loss.
L

[Mr Nobody]

OK, not arguing. I promise not to hurt anyone.

ever. I hope you guys who know me realize that. And I hope you know I ain't stupid.


Anyway, I don't miss, I aim at attitudes, not faces, OK?

[gengrant]

yeah, as that one guy from the Beatles said in that song he sang with that other guy from The Jackson Five, "I'm a lover, not a fighter."

I think the song was "The Girl is Mine."