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Post by acjade on Jun 19, 2006 12:51:43 GMT 7
Hear hear, Mr. Nobody. Well said.
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Post by Lotus Eater on Jun 19, 2006 12:55:36 GMT 7
However, we are a nation of migrants and this culture has been created by a mix of influences. Part of the freedom those struggles were about were religious freedoms, freedom from persecution for being different.
I would argue that being a multi-cultural community has strengthened and increased our national identity. Our 'fair go' concept was based on equality for all. As of June 2005 1/4 of Australia's population was born overseas - and that does not take into account people born in Oz with parents who migrated.
The Christian church in it's forms has majority of people stating at least a casual alignment, (this is also not the same as regular chruch goers attendees- a small minority of Australians) but there is a growing 'no religious affliation' component and a growing non-Christian affiliation.
Culture should not and cannot remain static, it should develop and incorporate the best of other cultures. Coming to a country does mean that you accept the laws, language, rights and responsibilities bestowed by that country - but it does not mean that you can no longer speak your own language, have your own beliefs. In China we need to learn Chinese and accept the laws and ways of doing things here - but this does not mean to say I can never eat vegemite while I am here, or that by my work I can't present glimpses of a different world to people.
Some of this speech seemed to come right from the early 1950's that John Howard delights in - forgetting to look in the dark corners of discrimination, prejudice and ignorance.
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Post by Lotus Eater on Jun 19, 2006 12:58:04 GMT 7
Section 116 of the 1900 Act to constitute the Commonwealth of Australia (Australian Constitution) provides that:
The Commonwealth of Australia shall not make any law establishing any religion, or for imposing any religious observance, or for prohibiting the free exercise of any religion, and no religious test shall be required as a qualification for any office or public trust under the Commonwealth.
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Post by Mr Nobody on Jun 19, 2006 13:29:18 GMT 7
He also is confused. Christianity = God, and Islam = Not God? Talk about bias.
I am not talking about the politicians here but the author.
Johnny has a point, such as one law. No shariah, thanks. Any more than Aboriginal law, or anything else. One law. But that applies to all inhabitants, such as the right to have your own religious beliefs, as ably pointed out by Lotus.
Everything after the comment "USA and Canada are you listening" is garbage.
Maybe the author ought to read his own missive, and go back to where he came from, if he doesn't like it.
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Post by Dragonsaver on Jun 19, 2006 17:34:12 GMT 7
Sent a reply to my brother explaining some of your (Aussi) feelings. He sent me the original e-mail.
I wasn't sure what your comments would be which is why I posted. If John Howard did say that on the TV? That could put Australia in the the 'negative' news.
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Post by Mr Nobody on Jun 19, 2006 18:33:59 GMT 7
He would be immediately sacked, is my guess. I assume you mean the second half of the guff, the editorial.
The stuff in front is somewhat fair enough to say, but people can differ.
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Non-Dave
Barfly
Try Not! Do - or Do Not... There Is No Try!
Posts: 701
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Post by Non-Dave on Jun 20, 2006 9:33:39 GMT 7
I agree with the part about "if you don't like it, leave". I didn't like it and I left. I still love Australia and don't want to be from anywhere else, just don't want to live there anymore.
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Post by Mr Nobody on Jun 21, 2006 19:26:46 GMT 7
And what is a real Australian? this was found in my email as an attempt at describing it. Unfortunatley, too much is only too true.
Definitive Guide to Aussies
1. The bigger the hat, the smaller the farm.
2. The shorter the nickname, the more they like you.
3. Whether it's the opening of Parliament, or the launch of a new art gallery, there is no Australian event that cannot be improved by a sausage sizzle.
4. If the guy next to you is swearing like a wharfie he's probably a media billionaire. Or.. on the other hand, he may be a wharfie.
5. There is no food that cannot be improved by the application of tomato sauce.
6. On the beach, all Australians hide their keys and wallets by placing them inside their sandshoes. No thief has ever worked this out.
7. Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the plastic milk crate.
8. All our best heroes are losers.
9. The alpha male in any group is he who takes the barbecue tongs from the hands of the host and blithely begins turning the snags.
10. It's not summer until the steering wheel is too hot to hold.
11. A thong is not a piece of scanty swimwear, as in America, but a fine example of Australian footwear. A group of sheilas wearing black rubber thongs may not be as exciting as you had hoped.
12. It is proper to refer to your best friend as "a total bastard". By contrast, your worst enemy is "a bit of a bastard".
13. Historians believe the widespread use of the word "mate" can be traced to the harsh conditions on the Australian frontier in the 1890s, and the development of a code of mutual aid, or "mateship". Alternatively, Australians may just be really hopeless with names.
14. The wise man chooses a partner who is attractive not only to himself, but to the mosquitoes.
15. If it can't be fixed with pantyhose and fencing wire, its not worth fixing.
16. The most popular and widely praised family in any street is the one that has the swimming pool.
17. Its considered better to be down on your luck than up yourself.
18. The phrase "we've got a great lifestyle," means everyone in the family drinks too much.
19. If invited to a party, you should take cheap red wine and then spend all night drinking the host's beer. (Don't worry; he'll have catered for it).
20. If there is any sort of free event or party within a hundred kilometres, you'd be a mug not to go.
21. The phrase "a simple picnic" is not known. You should take everything you own. If you don't need to make three trips back to the car, you're not trying.
22. Unless ethnic or a Pom, you are not permitted to sit down in your front yard, or on your front porch. Pottering about, gardening or leaning on the fence is acceptable. Just don't sit. That's what backyards are for.
23. The tarred road always ends just after the house of the local mayor.
24. On picnics, the Esky is always too small, creating a food versus grog battle that can only ever be resolved by leaving the salad at home.
25. When on a country holiday, the neon sign advertising the motels pool will always be slightly larger than the pool itself.
26. The men are tough, but the women are tougher.
27. The chief test of manhood is ones ability to install a beach umbrella in high winds.
28. Australians love new technology. Years after their introduction, most conversations on mobile phones are principally about the fact that the call is "being made on my mobile".
29. There comes a time in every Australians life when he/she realises that the Aerogard is worse than the flies.
And, finally, don't let the tourist books fool you. No one EVER says "cobber" to anyone ... EVER! It also doesn't have the bit about the true test for immigration to Australia. They give potential new Aussies the following test: Mowing a sloping lawn (at least 20 degree angle) in a pair of thongs holding a XXXX(Beer) while watching the cricket. If you can't pass that... Chances are, you will NEVER be able to pass yourself off as a true Aussie.
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Post by Lotus Eater on Jun 22, 2006 4:01:59 GMT 7
This one is really funny. At one time I bought a house block that the developers promised would have a bitumen road in fronr of it. Afterwards, when I started to build- mei you bitumen. Pointed this out to the developer. He had the council come along and bitumen just in front of my block! Only bit of bitumen on the entire road!!
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Post by Mr Nobody on Jun 22, 2006 5:31:35 GMT 7
Hey Non-Dave, i have been thinking about what you said, about leaving. The point I was trying to make is that sure, you can leave, it is your choice and your right.
But this individual has no right to tell you to just because you aren't a Christian.
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Non-Dave
Barfly
Try Not! Do - or Do Not... There Is No Try!
Posts: 701
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Post by Non-Dave on Jun 22, 2006 9:04:01 GMT 7
Yeah, true. I don't like the idea of anyone being told to leave, it should be an individual common sense thing...
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Post by Lotus Eater on Jun 22, 2006 9:31:31 GMT 7
And if being in a country was dependent on speaking the language how many of us would be still here? Most foreigners here are happy to learn enough Chinese to get home from town, or buy a few things. Few of them could conduct a long discussion in Chinese. Should we ask more of people coming to our countries?
The author of that silly missive has zero world view.
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Post by con's fly is open on Jun 22, 2006 19:29:40 GMT 7
I should point out that Canada has rejected Sharia tribunals- they violate the Charter.
That author's assertion that "This idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle" begs the question that Hogan culture, after all this time, is a flimsy, delicate folding screen that will blow over if enough people vindaloo in a foreign language. It also ignores the possibility that Hogans are the way they are because Australia is the way it is.
Some people fear change. It is to some extent the death of the old, but show a little faith!
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Post by Steiner on Jun 22, 2006 21:10:41 GMT 7
Interestingly enough, it is often the same set of people who want to protect indigenous cultures in other countries from cultural change while at the same time advocating continual cultural change in their own countires.
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Post by joe on Jun 22, 2006 21:53:37 GMT 7
[something] begs the question that Hogan culture, after all this time, is a flimsy, delicate folding screen that will blow over if enough people vindaloo in a foreign language. It also ignores the possibility that Hogans are the way they are because Australia is the way it is. After all this time? 200 years? One of the most frustrating conversations I have, and have constantly, with Chinese turns on the value of what Australia has, the knack of taking contributions from everywhere and making something new. I always talk about it in terms of food. See, Australia has no traditional foods, it has people working away making something new from something they saw down the street or over in their travels and mixing it with something they grew up with. And then also it has significant cultural groups keeping what they knew from the old country and making it to sell, and they're down the street. Chinese don't get that. Really. I might just as well try to have them enjoy a kebab and NOT tell me it's just kao rou only not as good.
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Post by Mr Nobody on Jul 1, 2006 20:37:26 GMT 7
Latest 9/msn (australian) online survey: So far.
Would you support the death penalty for convicted child murderers? 92788 yes 21633 No.
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Newbs
SuperDuperBarfly!
If you don't have your parents permission to be on this site, naughty, naughty. But Krusty forgives
Posts: 2,085
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Post by Newbs on Aug 18, 2006 14:19:32 GMT 7
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Post by George61 on Aug 18, 2006 14:35:04 GMT 7
Yeah, I read about that, Newbs...It must be a funny show.
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Post by George61 on Aug 19, 2006 5:19:00 GMT 7
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Newbs
SuperDuperBarfly!
If you don't have your parents permission to be on this site, naughty, naughty. But Krusty forgives
Posts: 2,085
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Post by Newbs on Aug 19, 2006 12:17:53 GMT 7
Just one more reason why I hate the b@st@rd government in power at the moment.
[glow=red,5000]Viva la revolucion! (sp?)[/glow]
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Post by The G-Stringed Avenger on Aug 19, 2006 15:11:54 GMT 7
Comments such as "Australia is a nation of immigrants" leave out the salient fact that the majority of those immigrants came from the UK in the past and many still do today. Before WW2, Australia's population was 90% Anglo-Celtic. Steady immigration existed then. Anglo-Celts created the Australian identity and yet more people from Anglo-Celtic backgrounds slotted right into it. To deny an Australian identity based on the fact that we are all immigrants is wrong. The immigrants and the identity were the same thing.
I disagree with the need to learn the language thing. However, that's not the same as ensuring English is the single and unifying official language of the nation. The more we make allowances for other languages in our official affairs, our education system and so on, the more we promote division. Why should we or our kids learn English? We'll all be catered for. That would be the opinion. Allow people to choose not to learn English if they can survive without it, but don't go catering to them. The PSB doesn't cater to me, and I wouldn't have it any other way. I can either do it on my own or I can get (unofficial) help.
And really, I'm tired of hearing Australia has no culture. Australia has a bright, vibrant, unique and distinctive culture. It is easily recognisable. It is not easy to define, but no culture is. It seems that we don't have it because Australian culture is the water in the multicultural soup. Sure, it seems plain when that's all you know, but there would be no soup without it. Multiculturalism is considered to be this Great Thing. No, multiculturalism is just greater than the sum of its parts. Each added ingredient is not superior to water - we're just told it is because it's exotic and new. The lie we are forced to believe is that every culture is superior to ours. They're not. They're not any deeper or richer or more profound, they just have the novelty factor working for them. Each one on its own is special, but not intrinsically incredible and wonderful. But we see the greater-than-the-sum-of-its-parts multiculturalism and we believe that it's all about the soup and that the water would have been nothing without it. Fine, and the potato and the carrot and the tomato each on its own would have been nothing without the others, either.
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Post by Hamish on Aug 20, 2006 8:04:57 GMT 7
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Post by George61 on Aug 20, 2006 16:54:52 GMT 7
The other side of Immigration. It helps to be an "athlete"....
Sa Leone athletes granted permanent stay
August 20, 2006 - 4:00PM
Ten Sierra Leone Commonwealth Games athletes who have been granted permanent visas have settled into the Australian way of life, a refugee advocate says.
The other four athletes from war-torn Sierra Leone who went missing from the athletes' village during the Melbourne games in March hope to be granted visas this week.
Refugee advocate David Addington said on Sunday 12 of the 14 athletes, all now living in Sydney, were working in a variety of occupations, including in factories, markets and the construction industry.
Of the remaining two, one was studying and the other was between jobs.
"They have already been accepted by the community and settled into the Australian way of life," Mr Addington said.
The four athletes who were yet to be granted permanent visas hoped this would occur by the end of the week.
"We are optimistically awaiting the happy news on the other four," Mr Addington said.
A spokesman for the Department of Immigration and Multicultural Affairs refused to confirm or deny the 10 athletes had been granted permanent visas.
He said applicants were advised individually of the outcome of their cases and it was up to them to decide if they wished to make the outcomes public.
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Post by Hamish on Aug 20, 2006 18:46:01 GMT 7
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Post by George61 on Aug 20, 2006 18:59:41 GMT 7
Nice find, Hamish!!
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